Minas Tirith City Hall (OOC)

Seven Stars and Seven Stones and One White Tree.
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Winddancer wrote: Mon Feb 07, 2022 10:15 pm But why could it not stay in Toasts thread? We generally try and avoid copies of existing threads so we dont cause confusion of where to post or take activity away from one thread to another.
I did offer a *few* reasons why, in my earlier post in support of @Rillewen's opening a new thread. :smile: The barracks thread was more or less exactly a copy of the earlier version of that thread as well. Just with an active thread runner who would be able to update the room allocations etc.

If credit is given at the bottom of the opening post, to the original thread starter, can we not just say it's a new thread for a fresh start because the other is so full ?
All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither, deep roots are not touched by the frost.

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@Rillewen Please take a gander at this quote from the RP Code of Conduct, just in case you missed it:
Life happens for TRs too, and it may occur that someone disappears while their thread is still running. If a thread seems to have reached its conclusion, or has reached such a length that a new thread seems to be warranted, you must make a good faith effort to contact the original TR before taking over the thread or creating a replacement.


Considering that the current thread still has active participants, copy/pasting the OP and creating a new thread is a bit of a faux pas. If you wanted to create something new, different, or with your own spin, that's totally fine! Under the circumstances, it probably would be best to reach out to both @Burnt Toast and anyone actively playing in the thread to get their thoughts on creating a new thread if you want to use the same OP content.

edit: bold emphasis mine
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Sorry, there is no such thing as a thread being too full and admins can edit easily, we are on every day. Fully taking someone elses OP and using it as your own is not encouraged. If Rill makes her own version, sorta fine, but it will still take away from another thread, aka competition. If you really want that on its own, I suggest reaching out to Toast and asking if you can take it and make it into its own thread. And I wasnt aware that the barracks did that too :/

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Winddancer wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 4:27 pm I think while you guys are making new threads, you should remake the Barracks thread as well, as Toasty wont be by to keep it up to date anytime soon. Of course we don't mind doing it, but it makes sense that someone active has the control over that to edit as they see fit :)

@Winddancer, with respect, the above quote is taken from your post in the Rangers Hq OOC thread, when we were talking about a new barracks thread. Which kind of suggested that the admins did not want to edit opening posts of existing threads, and that a new thread with an active thread runner was preferable ? :confused:
All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither, deep roots are not touched by the frost.

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The barracks requires way more updating than an OP for the street levels. But it was under the assumption that a NEW version was created and not just completely copied over. This would not be an issue if you write up your own version. Its more an issue when it is fully taken, from an active thread that is still in use, without any changes. Does that make sense? And no it was not meant as admins dont want to edit, more that people might want to be able to themselves.

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Alright, so the only actual issue seems to be that i copied some content from the other thread. I can change that. in fact, my plan was to copy it mostly as a placeholder while I find out more up-to-date information and change it, anyway. So I can just remove anything I borrowed from that thread, no problem.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

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I am sorry, honestly really not trying to cause an issue here, but rather to understand how we resolve this. I'm feeling rather responsible because I was the one talking about the new thread with @Rillewen in the first place. :wink:

The opening thread content in the new MT free rp thread is not an exact copy of the one Toastie posted back in 2020; the new version has omitted all info except the description of the seven circles, so thats a huge chunk not used. And things like references to the army have been updated to refer instead in the new thread as Rangers now.

If the issue is the part of the original content which was copied over, can we just amend the new opening post to an entirely new written description of the seven circles ? or will crediting Toastie as I notice Rillewen has already now done in her Opening post, be sufficient ?
All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither, deep roots are not touched by the frost.

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@Rillewen Perfect! :) Just keep in mind there is no hurry when creating a thread, its better to have the finished product ready than a placeholder :) We can wait for awesomeness ;)

@Ercassie Taking someones post needs to have permission from the person, so if you want to keep as is, ask Toast for permission. If you change it, its all good :)

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Alright, I have now removed any and all content that was copied from Toast's thread. And furthermore I'd like to say, I'm totally in favor of keeping Toast's thread going if everyone else agrees. I have several stories there, and was in a way hoping to expand our areas for RP by creating new threads, but I will go along with whatever everyone else agrees on.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

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Sorry for all this mess Rill, I really dont want to discourage you from opening new threads or make a big deal of it. I just misunderstood what was happening and that is completely my bad. Toast is on the plaza discord, they do respond, and I know they would likely be happy for you to use it, we just need the permission so its all kosher :)

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Just a note that most content in the city threads etc has been carried over through countless years from the "old-old" plaza and is based on the content created by Laielinwen, Naith, Findy and other honourable members and throughout plaza's existence has been built on and tweaked by many other thread runners to reflect the changes in the plaza situation. If anything, these first creators of the content should be credited for the bulk of the content which has nearly become the tradition. Unless the threads are built completely from scratch, that is. The basis for HoH and Ranger threads is very close to 2005 when I first found the plaza, though free threads have seen additions and removals, and yet the above-mentioned basis is there.
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Going to add my 2 cents here. Most of the main free rp area threads have historically been a combined cumulative effort over many years that get copied and tweaked and added to slowly. Occasionally there is completely new content, but not often, so giving credit can be challenging. As an example, I created the training grounds in the Pelennor Fields in 2011, moving them outside the city walls for the first time because it just seemed weird to think of essentially a large park (2 acres) situated in the city exclusively for training when it is a city of stone. That creation and the rewrite of what existed inside the headquarters is now part of what we think of as always having been there. It has been mentioned in every Training Ground thread since then, whether the thread runner chooses to set their thread inside or outside the walls. Up until that point it had always been the same. (Ranger reserves basic training being completely separate in Ithilien) Just to say, credit is nice when you know, but seems irrelevant to the long standing threads of numerous authors, and has never in the past prevented a reset of threads. It was always "well that one has pages and pages to look through. Lets start a new one." for the active threads. The full one would be closed and folks would simply move to the new thread. It was of course different for the threads that just died from lack of use, and then a new one would be opened to try and reignite interest. By all means check with the original poster if you are able to, it seems to be a good new concept, but I am also pointing out it is new practice. (I see Pele just posted similar.)
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New Soul
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Morning everyone from my corner of the world.

I know it might seem redundant now, however, if I may, I'd like to say a few words on this matter. Keeping in mind that I am not saying this as an admin, but as Nessa the Gondorian member of he Plaza who writes "Friends, countrymen, lend me your ears for in this essay I shall..." OOC posts. :winkkiss:


Sometimes all of us get swept in the enthusiasm, joy, energy of other people writing and creating wirh us and we want to keep that atmosphere going by being as creative as we can and opening up more avenues to create beautiful, awesome, funny etc. things. And in that mood we might not think things through properly because we want to keep going. And there is nothing wrong with that.

However, I would like to stress (as I and many have said before) that there is no rush with opening threads or writing posts or anything really. This is the Plaza, not an emergency service in the hospital. 😉 There is literally here RP wise that cannot wait for a few hours. So even if you get swept up in the enthusiasm or spring cleaning atmosphere (I get that feeling too you know 😜) there's no need to rush into anything.

Concerning ideas and taking over treads, @Moriel quoted the relevant section. Sometimes people are not aware who creates the description in the OP of a thread or don't know how to contact the TR of a thread they would like to revamp. That's totally fine and not an issue. We can't know everyone and everything. That's why asking and enquiring is crucial. If you don't know ask. There are no stupid questions and you are not required to know everything, but ask and other people will pitch in and help. In my experience whenever I wasn't sure what to do I asked (go ahead you can groan about my endless questions about any idea I had :lol:) and everyone who could pitched in. By asking for clarification or help when you're unsure you get all the information you need and things end up running smoother.

This brings me to the last point I wanted to make regarding any thread in general. In my experience and humble opinion a thing works best if you take the time to think it through. In the case of a thread that means it's purpose, the way you craft the opening post, the rules you want the thread to have and of course giving credit where credit is due. :nod: And you avoid the constant edits because you forgot to put something...

I'm not saying this to criticise anyone or their work or discourage anyone from opening a thead or to say things should be done in a certain way. I just want to, in good faith, share some of my musings, experiences and advices/things that helped me. :nod: So I hope you'll take this rambling post in the spirit that ir was intended and I hope that what I said was helpful.

P.S. I hope you're all alive after reading this :embarrassed: :lol:
She/her.
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@Nessa Saelind I am definitely on Team Turtle too, but on the other hand "make hay while the sun is shining" :grin: Enthusiasm and joy is a treasure to be cherished, very refreshing after a dry season.

Again, some threads in Gondor have become common knowledge, and no one really knows who the original authors were - no matter who the TR is, much of the OP remains the same, with slight changes. Those are like family heirlooms passed from one family member to the next. Besides, with such threads there is usually some form of discussion and agreement before closing/opening/changes, so it is never really a unilateral decision.

Anyway. *shrug* I better go and see if the rain has stopped to go for a run and see if a post or two can be written.
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If it is not clear whos it is, I guess just put a note saying it was copied from x thread? Would think that would suffice, especially if bringing in an ancient thread.

New Soul
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Hmmm if it's not clear who contributed to the OP, since Gondorian threads and OPs are like "family heirlooms" (@Pele Alarion this is a wonderful description and I shall borrow it whenever I can) maybe this could be a good line to use:
Some of the above was copied from X thread. The threadruner thanks everyone who has in any way contributed to the creation and the enrichment of the description for this thread.
You give credit where credit is due despite not knowing who did what, but it's still a nod to the previous contributors. :nod:
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Solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant
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Well, can't really argue with that. :wink: I think there used to be credits, at least in some threads, but those might have gone missing in the process. Luckily there is an edit button in the posts to fix any such things. :)
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Someone speaks of credits? I have somewhere about 30.000 of them stashed still from the old salary office. Thanks to visits each day, lol.
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Question for the good folx of Gondor, @Rillewen and I were talking and the idea of a Minas Tirith orphanage came up, so my question is, was that ever a think here in the Elder Days of OP? If so, does anyone have any clue where/when I might look through the archives to see what I can pull and does anyone have any objections to myself and Rill running it?
Strange Fruit got holes in the flesh but it ain't gonn' spoil cause it never was fresh

Steward of Gondor
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this is all that I know of: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=189
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

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The closest NuPlaza came to that was the Daycare: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=189 Dont recall an orphanage on OP. But seeing as none are made here and you dont complete copy without asking, go for it :)

Balrog
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excellent double posting :rofl: did you two plan that?
Strange Fruit got holes in the flesh but it ain't gonn' spoil cause it never was fresh

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We are one.

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:rofl: Uh yeah. totally planned... :grin:
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Balrog
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Went down the rabbit hole of the archives looking for anything that might lead to a good template, and instead I found a Gondor pub I participated in and have now died of embarrassment, sorry everyone!
Strange Fruit got holes in the flesh but it ain't gonn' spoil cause it never was fresh

Éowyn
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Well, it won't do to dangle the fish but not hook the bait! What is this pub you speak of? XD
Arnyn ~ Honor & Valor
Kaylin ~ Joy & Strength

Balrog
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Telcontar's Tavern, back in the halcyon days of October 2002. My god my writing was so bad in those days, a 14 year old git with the self-awareness of a turnip
Strange Fruit got holes in the flesh but it ain't gonn' spoil cause it never was fresh

Éowyn
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:lol: Isn't it nice to see how much you've grown, though
Arnyn ~ Honor & Valor
Kaylin ~ Joy & Strength

Balrog
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I'm sure there are some that would contend that I haven't grown up at all
Strange Fruit got holes in the flesh but it ain't gonn' spoil cause it never was fresh

Éowyn
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Who said grown up? *shivers* I just meant grown as a writer. :grin:
Arnyn ~ Honor & Valor
Kaylin ~ Joy & Strength

Child of Gondor
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This place is like a giant warm hug! *sigh*
(....wanders off in search of the Horn of Gondor Pub)
~Second Knight in the Order of the White Tree~
Owner of Haldamista Maru, hunting dog & Turgar Maru, loyal steed

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@Dirion Telpelen !!! *adds a smaller hug to the giant one* :grouphug:
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Éowyn
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Yeaaaah, Dirion! Hiya! XD Come play!
Arnyn ~ Honor & Valor
Kaylin ~ Joy & Strength

Captain of Tower
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Welcome Dirion! Great to see you. We haven't started the Horn of Gondor pub yet in this iteration, but perhaps that can be next after the Old Guesthouse?
Ziranphel of the Green Hills ~ Thûllir Bregedŷr of Ithilien

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Woo @Dirion Telpelen is back! I have since ditched the "Indo" first part of my name but it's good to see you around again!

High Warden of Tower
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Well, and now everyone go and post somewhere, please! :tongue: :lol:
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Master Torturer
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Welcome back, Dirion!

Child of Gondor
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Hello there! It's fantastic to "read" you all again. I hope time has been good to you all. I have to admit I'm here a bit on a whim. Typed in the website to see if it still existed....and it DOES! In this iteration at any rate. Thanks to those who are keeping the dream alive. I don't know if this would be of any use or not but back in the day during my time as Gondor Admin, I download the entire contents of the Gondor Server. Every image file, web page .isp files, headers, Ranger rank badges, special rank icons, etc. I am not a web site builder but I'm happy to share with you guys if it would be useful. Not sure how much time I will actually spend here but wanted to at least offer that.
~Second Knight in the Order of the White Tree~
Owner of Haldamista Maru, hunting dog & Turgar Maru, loyal steed

Master Torturer
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Oh wow, that would be awesome Dirion! You can put it either in the Gondor archive thread or in Nulibrary :D

Here is the one for Gondor: viewtopic.php?t=375
Nulibrary is a subforum in Lore

Black Númenórean
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Dirion, welcome back! :dance:
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Evil is a lifestyle | she/her

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Dear friends, I wanted to let you know that I will likely be away from posting for a while longer. My brother died today, and while I am glad his long and painful battle with the effects of cancer is over, it has been a rough several days. I will be doing his funeral Saturday between Good Friday and Resurrection Sunday. This community has been part of my support, so thank you.
Ziranphel of the Green Hills ~ Thûllir Bregedŷr of Ithilien

Éowyn
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Karis, I'm so sorry to hear that. I messaged you privately, but also wanted to mention here that of course not being able to post is something everyone here understands. You should take all the time you need. Much love.
Arnyn ~ Honor & Valor
Kaylin ~ Joy & Strength

Master Torturer
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So sorry to hear that, Karis. Sending much love to you all <3

New Soul
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Aww Karis: Aww, I am sad to hear this. I lost once my mother to the same sickness, I know it is very rough and raw. My condolences. Love to you and your family. :smooch:
Just call me Aiks or Aikári. Notify is off.
Find me stuff in Gondolin.
And let us embark to Valinor!

High Warden of Tower
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Karis, deepest condolences! May God give you and your family comfort and peace!
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Istari Sage
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My condolences Karis. Wishing you strength and love during this difficult time.

Khazad Elder
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Sadden to hear about your brother, Karis. Sending strength and love your way.
The world was fair in Durin's Day

Éowyn
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*hugs everyone* It's never easy to say something to such news, but I'm glad to see people are looking for a way.
Besides the point... spotted an egg in here.
Arnyn ~ Honor & Valor
Kaylin ~ Joy & Strength

Chief Counsellor of Gondor
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Karis, :cry:. Though your presence here shall be missed, you must of course take all the time you need under such sad circumstances. Condolences to you and to your family. :smooch:

And while I am here; ahem. noticed recently :
Arnyn wrote: Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:30 pmOtherwise, the Southern Fiefdoms thread continues here: viewtopic.php?t=868
(A new thread, by the same thread runner (Ercassie). Maybe @Ercassie can close this one?)
I did in fact request in this City Hall thread, back in January, that the old Southern Fiefdoms thread be closed, in favour of the new replacement.
My post making that request is linked here. :wink:
viewtopic.php?p=49132#p49132

And @Winddancer's kind agreement to manage this request is linked here.
viewtopic.php?p=49135#p49135

I imagine that, random OOC egg quests aside, all stories that were taking place there have been given more than enough time (three months) now to finish up what they were doing, if they did not wish to continue over into the new thread.
So may I please repeat the request ? Thankyou.
All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither, deep roots are not touched by the frost.

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@Ercassie Its my bad, will lock it again. I didnt know the requirements for the Egg hunt when I hid the eggs and it required posting in the thread it was found. I had put a few eggs in locked threads, so unlocked them until eggs are found. They will be locked once found. Sorry for the inconvenience!

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