On Isolation

[Lail]

I started thinking about this while re-reading TTT. I’ve always drawn parallels between hobbits and Ents in my mind-- though opposite in many ways, they have a lot in common: love of plants and earth, peace and quiet, and keeping to themselves.

One step further and I thought of the theme of isolationism in regard to hobbits and Ents. Both are reluctant to involve themselves in the world outside (“The wide world is all about you: you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out” to quote Gildor), isolating themselves in their safe spaces of the Shire and Fangorn, respectively. They both wound up being part of greater events in Middle-earth, both contributing to the defeat of Saruman, but only reluctantly when there was no other choice (The Last March of the Ents; see below) or when prompted by others to act (The Battle of Bywater).

'But if we stayed at home and did nothing, doom would find us anyway, sooner or later. That thought has long been growing in our hearts; and that is why we are marching now. Now at last the march of the Ents may be worth a song. Aye’, he sighed, ‘we may help the other peoples before we pass away.’

- (Treebeard) Treebeard, The Two Towers

There are other isolated or hidden communities (Gondolin and Imladris come to mind though they are not quite as cut off from the world at least to my memory) in the Legendarium but the difference to me is that those were hidden by need to survive/outlast the Enemy whereas hobbits and Ents sort of closed themselves off by choice (though I suppose one could argue Ents were pushed into it by the destruction of the great forests so they could only find sanctuary in Fangorn).

This hasn’t been super well thought out as you can see, but I thought it might potentially start some interesting discussion. I guess I also wonder if this was at all intentional on Tolkien’s part, to comment on the pitfalls of isolation.

[Saranna]

Hi @Lailsheenbo what a topical theme, with isolation forcing its way into our lives this last two years. I have also reflected on Gondolin, Nargothrond and Doriath in terms of their isolationism, and its effect on the pattern of events in Middle-earth. I think they were genuinely isolationist in outlook, and more so as time went on. Access to their strongholds was difficult for mortals and sometimes for elves of different kinds. Something else these three have in common is the horror of their ends, swept away by the forces of evil. Even in later times there was a sense of defensive withdrawal in Eregion and Lorien, and Galadriel points out that the saving of Middle-earth for mortals will only speed the waning of the elves and their leaving Middle-earth. I will follow this thread with interest and hope others will too.

(PS I love cats too.)

[Boromir88]

This hasn’t been super well thought out as you can see, but I thought it might potentially start some interesting discussion. I guess I also wonder if this was at all intentional on Tolkien’s part, to comment on the pitfalls of isolation.

I believe Tolkien was intentionally making a point on isolationism. I haven't super well thought this out myself, just random observations over the years. I never thought about the Ents isolationism, that's a great point.

What has always stood out to me about this topic is Gandalf and Bombadil. I'm paraphrasing Gandalf here, but he calls Bombadil a "moss-gatherer" where he is a "stone doomed to rolling." Bombadil has immeasurable mastery within his own borders, but they are self-imposed borders. Outside those borders, Bombadil is powerless. Gandalf is arguably the biggest mover and shaker in Middle-earth and with that he's viewed negatively by some. Hobbits gossip he's responsible for the disappearances of many hobbit children. Grima says Gandalf is a "bearer of ill news." Yet, without Gandalf's movements and actions, the races of Middle-earth would become further isolated.

Isolationism is a strategy employed by Tolkien's villains. It plays a big part in Saruman's plot to control Theoden:

In any case Theoden's sense of weakness and dependence on Grima was largely due to the cunning and skill of this evil counsellor's suggestions. It was his policy to bring his chief opponents into discredit with Theoden, and if possible to get rid of them. (Unfinished Tales: The Battles of the Fords of Isen)

Grima believed his chief opponents were Theodred and Eomer, so it was part of his plans to cut Theoden off from his family, even "get rid of them," if necessary, which would isolate Theoden from his family.

Denethor's dissent into madness, is I would say caused by isolation. It notably began after the death of his wife, but got worse with Boromir's death:

'After her death Denethor became more grim and silent than before, and would sit long alone in his tower deep in thought, foreseeing that the assault of Mordor would come in his time...
...Thus pride increased in Denethor together with despair, until he saw in all the deeds of that time only a single combat between the Lord of the White Tower and the Lord of the Barad-dur, and mistrusted all others who resisted Sauron, unless they served himself alone. (Lord of the Rings: Appendix A - Gondor and the Heirs of Anarion)

You've found interesting parallels between the hobbits and Ents, I've often thought about the parallels between Theoden and Denethor. Both are rulers over a kingdom of Men, both lost their wives, both lost their heirs, both fall into isolationism. But Theoden is saved in end by his acceptance of Gandalf, as he refers to Gandalf as his "new counselor." And Theoden rejects isolation, as one of my favorite lines comes from Theoden in Helm's Deep:

"The end will not be long," said the king. "But I will not end here, taken like an old badger in a trap."

Denethor rejects Gandalf and falls to despair, which I believe increasing isolation leads to increasing despair.

[Nessa Saelind]

I've been musing on this topic since you've opened this thread, Lail. The examples of isolation you chose are interesting, especially when it comes to Hobbits and Ents.

I think when it comes to Ents and Hobbits that both groups chose isolation, not for political reasons (as it's usually the case in these matters), but rather because of their nature, so to speak. Whereas in cases of the elven kingdoms like Gondolin, Doriath, Lorien etc. the isolationism is more a political choice/decision than the desire or the nature of elves to dedicate themselves to "simple", everyday life.

When I thought about the purposeful isolation of various elven kingdoms through the ages, they reminded me more of cycles of isolation that Japan and the US historically went through. Now that I think about it, in Gondolin we can see both the non-interventionism policy and sakoku period during the Tokugawa shogunate in Japan...

@Boromir88 - it's interesting that you brought up Theoden and Denethor as examples of isolationism that are caused by a slow descent into madness. And how Gandalf managed to save one and not the other, despite the fact that Denethor had more cause to live for. He had a living son, that he loved despite the fact that he didn't know how to show that love... Theoden with Gandalf's help managed to recover enough (because I don't think he ever recovered from the death of his child - I don't think any parent recovers from that) to lead his people and fight for a better future, despite never getting to see it himself. Eh I think I meandered a bit off-topic here

[Androthelm]

I really like a lot of what's been said here -- especially the variety of isolations that @Nessa Saelind brought up. That being said, I think one really core part of the Hobbits' arc in LoTR seems (to me, anyway) to be them turning away from their isolation before it is too late -- much like Theoden, and much less like Denethor. The Hobbits may believe it is in their nature to never leave the Shire, but that's not the case -- they can do more, if they're willing to step out, as are the Ents.

On this topic of the dangerous of isolation, though, how do we read the end of the books, when the Shire is declared ... if not sovereign, at least hard-bordered against Men, by the authority of the King? Is that a reinforcement of isolation, or something else?

[Nessa Saelind]

What an interesting question @Androthelm!

I went to look at the Later Events Concerning the Members of the Fellowship of the Ring in Appendix B to see how Tolkien actually defined this

S.R. 1427 (...) King Elessar issues an edict that Men are not to enter the Shire, and he makes it a Free Land under the protection of the Northern Sceptre.
S.R. 1434 (...) King Elessar makes the Thain, the Master, and the Mayor Counsellors of the North-kingdom.
S.R. 1452 The Westmarch, from the Far Downs to the Tower Hills (Emyn Beraid), is added to the Shire by the gift of the King. Many hobbits remove to it.

A bit of a side note: I found something interesting regarding S.R. 1472 on Tolkien Gateway.

S.R. 1427 King Elessar issues an edict that Men are not to enter the Drúadan Forest and Shire (emphasis my own), and he makes it a Free Land under the protection of the Northern Sceptre

.

The part about the Drúadan Forest is odd, because in The Return of the King, Chapter 6 Many Partings it states:

Without haste and at peace they passed into Anórien, and they came to the Grey Wood under Amon Dîn; and there they heard a sound as of drums beating in the hills, though no living thing could be seen. Then Aragorn let the trumpets be blown; and heralds cried:
‘Behold, the King Elessar is come! The Forest of Drúadan he gives to Ghân-buri-Ghân and to his folk, to be their own for ever; and hereafter let no man enter it without their leave!’
Then the drums rolled loudly, and were silent.

So the Drúadan Forest was declared a protected enclave well before The Shire was made a free land. However, to get back to the question at hand. The Shire is a part of Arnor and as such, it became part of The Reunited Kingdom. However, I think that by declaring the Shire a Free Land with its own system of governance (such as it was) Aragorn was just confirming the status quo. However, by including the Thrain (Tooks), the Master (of Buckland, Brandybucks) and the Mayor into the ranks of the Councillors of the Northern part of the Kingdom and expanded the territory of the Shire, Aragorn is deliberately including the Shire into his Kingdom. He is giving them a seat at the table and their voices on various governing matters will be heard. So declaring the Shire a Free Land is not a confirmation of isolation, rather giving the region more rights and increasing its importance. They are now part and parcel of the Reunited Kingdom. But it would be interesting to know how much did the Thrain, the Master and the Mayor partake in those councils...

[Lail]

@Boromir88, interesting take on Theoden vs. Denethor! I think you have a good point there but I wonder if you think having Eowyn at his side was also a help to Theoden while Denethor rejected Faramir, further driving a wedge between himself and others? Denethor also had the Palantir to contend with though I suppose Grima and Saruman’s influences could be compared to the Palantir for Theoden-- sowing seeds of doubt and despair. What do you think?


On the idea of personal isolation, this is something I thought about a little but didn’t include in my OP to keep it shorter and semi-focused. I’d comment on Frodo’s continued efforts to isolate himself. Aside from being the Ring-bearer and the inherent isolation that comes with the role, he continually tries to slip away from his friends and go alone right from the start when he plans to leave the Shire without them and again when he leaves the Fellowship at Amon Hen. And I'm sure there are other examples I am not thinking of right now.


Isolationist policies such as those of Japan and the US were in the back of my mind when I was thinking about this, too, so I’m glad you brought it up @Nessa Saelind. I didn’t mention it because I’m not a historian and didn’t have much more to say other than that I found it interesting given real-world isolationism, if that influenced or inspired, consciously or subconsciously, any of Tolkien’s isolationist themes.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Hello @Lailyn,
"The ideal of isolationism seems very present throughout the story but, after we arrive at Bree, an ideal no longer with reality in the world."

My original reply was not very helpful. This is a next day edit. I think I'm saying much the same as @Boromir88. Isolationism is an acute term to bring to LOTR. I suggest looking at Tom Bombadil, master of the ultimate isolated realm of the story, and also the dates of composition of the story (as revealed by the HOME volumes) in relation to a singular date, September 3, 1939, on which day Great Britain declared war on Nazi Germany.

The story from Crickhollow to Bree was set out (with a few later additions) in the summer of 1938. The sequel to The Hobbit was then envisaged as about the same length and though the magic ring is already the Ruling Ring of the Necromancer, there is as yet no hint of a War of the Ring. From this perspective, Bombadil as the spirit of the English countryside seems to represent for Tolkien some original enchantment that cannot be caught by the evil snares of the necromancy stirring abroad.

Only in winter 1940, in Moria, did Tolkien step finally into the story we know, the legendary War of the Ring (distinguished from the newly imagined mythical War of the Rings of the Second Age) and drawing in the Silmarillion via the story of Numenor via the hobbit Trotter transforming into Aragorn the heir of Elendil.

Now, suddenly in 1940 (and this was pointed out by halfir) Tolkien inserts dialogue into the Council of Elrond about Bombadil's self-imposed isolation, borders that he will not pass. in his Onion thread, halfir also pulls out a letter from the early 1950s in which Tolkien aligns himself with 'the view of Rivendell' and convincingly argues that Bombadil came to represent for Tolkien a kind of pacifism that was noble but not sustainable in the face of real world evil.

You can read all this as you will. My sense is that 'isolationism' became a characteristic of Tom Bombadil and Goldberry only after the onset of World War II, when Tolkien commenced a profound reflection on the general limitations of his own vision of 1938, as revealed by descent into a second European war. I read the Lady Galadriel as a reworking of the Enchantment of the house of Tom and Goldberry, but with a 'Fairie' that must now take sides and choose, that is tempted by the Ring rather than indifferent to it. And I read the story of King Theoden of Rohan as a coming to terms with Appeasement, an exploration in fairy story of the honeyed-lies of peace spoken by the Enemy and eagerly believed by craven hearts at home (and here I read an element of self-criticism by the author).

Where even ents and hobbits must take sides in the War of the Ring, Tom and Goldberry never do, and so as the new story unfolds they become an ideal of isolation. Tolkien seems to have discovered the ideal only once he realized it was lost, which perhaps made the story between Crickhollow and Bree all the more valuable in his mind even as it became irrelevant to the story he felt he now had to tell.

Hope that makes sense. It seems clear to me but expression is difficult.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

S.R. 1427 (...) King Elessar issues an edict that Men are not to enter the Shire, and he makes it a Free Land under the protection of the Northern Sceptre.
S.R. 1434 (...) King Elessar makes the Thain, the Master, and the Mayor Counsellors of the North-kingdom.
S.R. 1452 The Westmarch, from the Far Downs to the Tower Hills (Emyn Beraid), is added to the Shire by the gift of the King. Many hobbits remove to it.

Curious how the third royal edict transforms the Shire itself.

1427 and 1434 set out relations of 'Free Land' not entered by men but under protection of the King (sounds similar to the Drúadan Forest) and with Shire masters deemed Counsellors of the King.

1452 the King extends the western border of the Shire to encompass the land towards the havens (I guess from where the elves have already and long ago left). Now within the Shire are the three elf towers told of (I think) in the Prologue, of which we are told the hobbits know of but would never climb the tallest tower to see the sea, of which they were afraid. This tallest tower appears in Frodo's dream in Crickhollow - he wants to climb the stairs and sees the sea but wakes up and must enter the Old Forest. After the King gives the gift, Sam's daughter removes with her husband to the new colony of Undertowers, where she is given the Red Book (that is the LOTR) before Sam departs over the sea.

The new Shire, integrated with and isolated from the reforged kingdom of the North as it may be, is curiously different from the old Shire because one part of it - the new west country - now has elvish roots.

[Boromir88]

Oh, that's a good point @Lailyn about Denethor also rejecting Faramir and Theoden taking in Eomer and Eowyn as if they were his own children after his sister died.

I also agree about Frodo personal isolation, because he often has a desire to leave his friends behind, or to be alone. I wonder though if this is an effect of the Ring changing Frodo? I can't for the life of me find if Galadriel's quote from the movie is something that comes out of the books or not. I mean in the Mirror of Galadriel scene, when she says "You are a Ring-bearer, to bear a ring of power is to be alone."

Whether that is a direct quote out of the books or not, I do think it can be argued it's a true statement about bearing a ring of power. Gandalf is a wanderer, he refers to himself as a "stone doomed to rolling." He never stays in one place for long. Elrond's wife is captured, tortured and departs for Valinor. Arwen chooses to be with a mortal, Elladan and Elrohir choose to fight with the Dunedain and train others how to kill orcs to revenge their mother's torture. Galadriel uses Nenya to preserve and protect Lothlorien, which she created be like her own personal "undying lands," because she longs to return West, but was exiled for following Feanor.

And as for the Ringwraiths, I won't ever forget the description when Frodo first hears their cries: They stopped short suddenly. Frodo sprang to his feet. A long-drawn wail came down the wind, like the cry of some evil and lonely creature. (A Shortcut to Mushrooms)

I think it's possible Frodo's desire to flee from his friends is the Ring's influence working on Frodo. Although, perhaps he's always had a desire to be personally isolated. He remains a bachelor, has expressed a desire to follow in Bilbo's footsteps and leave the Shire. So that feeling has always been present in Frodo and perhaps the Ring is bringing those desires to the forefront where Frodo has these urges to escape and separate himself from his friends?

Then tying in with this idea that @Chrysophylax Dives brings up with Bombadil. Bombadil appears to be an outlier here. He is an isolationist, but this characteristic is not portrayed negatively when we encounter Bombadil. I like Chrysophylax's idea that perhaps isolationism was an ideal that Tolkien held, but the real world makes isolationism unsustainable. I'm reminded of the quote:

'But it is not your own Shire,' said Gildor. 'Others dwelt here before hobbits were; and others will dwell here again when hobbits are no more. The wide world is all about you: you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out.' (Three is Company)

I think what's also important in distinguishing Bombadil's isolation from that of someone like Sauron, or Saruman, is Bombadil's boundaries are specifically mentioned as being self-imposed. That is Bombadil's "free will" to choose his own borders and doesn't seek to dominate others "free will." Sauron, Saruman (and to a lesser extent Denethor) make themselves isolated, but their sins are to bulldoze and dominate the free will of others, and to build their own world order:

Denethor lauged bitterly. "Nay not yet, Master Peregrin! He will not come save only to triumph over me when all is won. He uses others as his weapons. So do all great lords, if they are wise, Master Halfling. Or why should I sit here in my tower and thing, and watch, and wait, spending even my sons? For I can still wield a brand." (The Siege of Gondor)

[Boromir88]

One thought I want to put out for the thread. Apologies to @Lailyn if this is off topic from the original post. In another thread I was thinking about Tolkien writing characters who are foils, and I got to wondering if he did the same with his races and communities.

For example, as discussed the Elves tend to be isolationist. Even the Noldor who rebelled, their movement was because of the Valar ban and exile. Gondolin, Nargothrond, Doriath, Imladris, Lorien they all choose isolation. Haldir says to the Fellowship that they don't communicate with the outside world, except sometimes with Rivendell.

The Shire chose to be isolationist, not out of any known threat (and in truth this was only achieved because of the Dunedain guarding them ceaselessly), but it made them stubborn and ignorant of the wider world. It seems that Tolkien thought there was a certain appeal to isolationism, but he also checked it with consequences. That is to say, in his world there are drawbacks to being on extreme or the other. Sometimes the consequences were major (like Gondolin and Nargothrond's complete destruction) and other times minor (Sharkey's invasion of the Shire), but there were drawbacks to being extremely isolationist.

Now, as the foil, there are the Numenoreans and their descendants, Gondorians. They were the opposite. They were "globalists" and nationalistic. They sought to expand their influence out of a belief they could 'enlighten' the lesser Men. Their "Fall," as a society, was aided by Sauron, but it was from excessive pride and becoming too expansionist.

[Lail]

These are all such interesting thoughts! Thanks for sharing! Your timeline sheds some light on Tom B’s isolation for sure, @Chrysophylax Dives.

Please don’t worry at all about side-tracking, I like to see discussions move in different directions! I also apologize for often being so slow at coming back to my own lore threads, but honestly, I am quite happy to see others continue discussion in my absence.


Everything you both said got me thinking more about what drove various ME peoples to isolate themselves. Elves, at least, seem to have done so out of self-protective measures for their own populations. Ents, to me, also sort of seem to have done it for self-protection and possibly out of feeling disconnected with other beings/lack of shared values with others (e.g., Treebeard says “I go my own way; but your way may go along with mine for a while”* and “I do not like worrying about the future. I am not altogether on anybody’s side, because nobody is altogether on my side, if you understand me: nobody cares for the woods as I care for them”*). Hobbits…I can’t really say, I guess it’s just in their nature to keep to themselves.

But why did Tom B isolate himself? To protect himself and/or Goldberry? From what? It doesn’t seem there is any great threat to them at least from what we get to see. Given his deep connection with, and power over, the land in which he lives around the Withywindle, perhaps he isolated himself in order to protect that land and all things that live and tread upon it. Perhaps Tom B’s isolation came from a sense of purpose to protect others vs. the Elves/Ents (and Hobbits to a certain degree) intention to protect themselves. Maybe this is part of the idealized isolation vs. the reality of isolation (with consequences as Boro said.)

I’m not sure what point I’m trying to make and I haven’t thought this through a ton, I just found it an interesting line of thought about all of this…

(*Both quotes from Ch 4, Treebeard, The Two Towers)