Tree-Twisting Riddles

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Frost: Sorry, not Melian.

Drifa: Not Ingwë, but you are pretty close.

[Drífa]

Hmm, okay. What about Rúmil?

A Noldorin sage of Tirion, the first deviser of written characters (cf. The Lord of the Rings Appendix E II); to him is attributed the Ainulindalë. 67-8 The Silmarillion Index

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Drifa: Not Rumil, but very close. You know him.

[The Good Hunter]

Going off that, is it Pengolodh?

[Aikári Salmarinian]

No, not Pengolodh, who know his works.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Durin

[The Good Hunter]

Eriol?

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Neither of them, with Pengolodh and Rumil was the right direction, but not complete.

[Drífa]

Salmar, the maker of the Ulumúri?

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Bingo! You have it, Drifa! Floor is yours.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Wow. Drifa, you have this two-riddle threads thing nailed. Gollum in Fangorn and Bilbo Baggins in the Shire one moment, Bilbo in Fangorn and Gollum in the Shire the next.

[Drífa]

Thanks! Here is a Middle-earth-related one.

Listen!
Sadness released droplets from above
in passing, pearly on the lowland
What, that the fall, the fire, had not
evanesced me into nonexistence,
easing would still be a possibility.
What am I?

[The Good Hunter]

Are you the tears of Nienna?

[Drífa]

No, I am not the tears of Nienna.

[Drífa]

Here's a hint. Not many Tolkien characters had the opportunity to fly. But some did.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Alright, a guess: a Silmaril?

[Drífa]

Hmm, no.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Hmm, no.

Don't hmm me! It is not such a stupid guess (we have the flying and the fire). But this one is going to take a while. I'll be back when I have another thought.

[Silky Gooseness]

Glorfindel

[Drífa]

No, Sil, it is not Glorfindel. The riddle asks, what am I? :)

[Drífa]

Eagles do fly.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Right, but you are not Bilbo on an eagle. I don't see how you are Gandalf. The fall and the fire point to the Ring and Frodo and Sam's rescue from Mount Doom, but I don't get the sadness releasing pearls on the lowlands. Maybe I am missing some eagle flights in 'The Silmarillion'?

By the way, how did Dwarves work out how to calculate again when Durin's Day falls?

[Drífa]

You will have to look deep into the history for the answer to this riddle.

'The first day of the dwarves' New Year,' said Thorin, 'is as all
should know the first, day of the last moon of Autumn on the threshold of
Winter. We still call it Durin's Day when the last moon of Autumn and the
sun are in the sky together. But this will not help us much, I fear, for it
passes our skill in these days to guess when such a time will come again.' The Hobbit

But I am sure this might vary in different parts of the world, wouldn't you say?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

You will have to look deep into the history for the answer to this riddle.

'But this will not help us much, I fear, for it passes our skill in these days to guess when such a time will come again.'

1. That is what I feared. I will have to open the Silmarillion, which I have never done before.

2. I did read The Hobbit once, and knew already that it passes the skill of the Dwarves to guess the date. So either Dwarves have learned something they had forgotten, or you are getting help from Elves or something.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Never realized how many eagels there were in the Silmarillion...

How about: Beren's hand?

[Drífa]

No, not Beren's hand.

I understand that the new year starts two weeks after the Last Quarter, also known as the Third Quarter, when the New Moon appears. This would be New Moon: October 14, 1:55 P.M. EDT. Now, if the Sun and the Moon had both been in the sky on that day, it would be known as Durin's Day. According to a search, though, it appears that there was a Solar eclipse on October 14. I am not sure when the next Durin's Day will occur.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

I understand that the new year starts two weeks after the Last Quarter, also known as the Third Quarter, when the New Moon appears. This would be New Moon: October 14, 1:55 P.M. EDT. Now, if the Sun and the Moon had both been in the sky on that day, it would be known as Durin's Day. According to a search, though, it appears that there was a Solar eclipse on October 14. I am not sure when the next Durin's Day will occur.

It is clear that you can calculate Durin's Day. But Thorin and the Dwarves of the late 3rd Age could not. So what do you have that they did not?

I'm not going to make another stupid guess that is obviously wrong just to justify this post. But I will go back to the Silmarillion, which is good for me. Seemed to me yesterday that the eagles are the originally far-seeing instrument.

[Drífa]

The dwarves could calculate the New Year, which differs from Durin's Day. They couldn't figure when the Sun and Moon were in the sky on the same day as the New Year. That is what I understand from the quote. Maybe they just lost interest in the old tradition?

You will find evidence of the answer to the riddle in the Silmarillion, but the answer lies deeper in the histories. I did not want to immediately ruin your time with the Silmarillion, which you said 'is good for me'.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Beren's other hand?

The dwarves could calculate the New Year, which differs from Durin's Day. They couldn't figure when the Sun and Moon were in the sky on the same day as the New Year. That is what I understand from the quote.

Agreed. To me that suggests that they had astronomical models but lost them. To be honest, I never thought about it until I realized that Dwarves today believe that they have powers lost to those like Fili, Kili, and Bombur. That just makes me a tad suspicious.

[Drífa]

Hahaha, no, not his other hand. Beren is, in part, related to the riddle.

[Drífa]

Tears of Nienna and Beren's hand are close guess related to this riddle. You have to go to the Histories to discover the answer.

HOUSE RIDDLE

Middle-earth-Related
Listen!
Sadness released droplets from above
in passing, pearly on the lowland
What, that the fall, the fire, had not
evanesced me into nonexistence,
easing would still be a possibility.
What am I?

[Drífa]

Meanwhile, here is a riddle that you can ponder.

[Romeran]

Could it be the Two Trees of Valinor? The sadness released droplets refers to Nienna's tears, the fall refers to the destruction of the trees by Melkor and Ungoliant and if they had not done so perhaps things would not have turned out as they did? Idk could be grasping at straws here

[Drífa]

Are you the tears of Nienna?

Yes, and I think you have grasped a used straw, hahaha. I would read the posts following Akhenanat's to get some information on this riddle, @Romeran. As mentioned above, you must search deep in the histories for the answer. *grin*

[Romeran]

Hmm are you Thuringwethil?

[Ephtariat]

Are you Maedhros's hand?

[Drífa]

Not Thuringwethil. Remember, not who I am but what I am. No, not Maedhros's hand, but that is a good guess.

As I mentioned, you must search deep in the history of M-e for the answer to this riddle.

[Romeran]

Are you the Leaves of the Elm Trees?

[Drífa]

Umm, no, not the Leaves of the Elm Trees. Pray do tell, what Leaves of the Elm Trees are these?

[Romeran]

From The Cottage of Lost Plays right at the beginning of BoLT 1:

"And then the wide-umbraged elm begins to fail;
Her mourning multitudes of leaves go pale.
Seeing afar the icy shears
Of Winter, and his blue-tipped spears
Marching unconquerable upon the sun
Of bright All-Hallows. Then their hour is done,
And wanly borne on wings of amber pale
They beat the wide airs of the fading vale
And fly like birds across the misty meres." (BoLT 1)

[Drífa]

Oh, that is lovely. I enjoy the BoLT 1 and 2. You are heading in the right direction. Search a little deeper.

[Drífa]

How about the last riddle becomes the house riddle, and the floor is now open to whoever wishes to take it?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

How about the last riddle becomes the house riddle, and the floor is now open to whoever wishes to take it?

Drifa, it is just not possible for us to begin a new riddle while this one still stands. Go on, give us a clue. Pretty please. Pretty please with honey and sugar

Middle-earth-Related
Listen!
Sadness released droplets from above
in passing, pearly on the lowland
What, that the fall, the fire, had not
evanesced me into nonexistence,
easing would still be a possibility.
What am I?

[Drífa]

As I said, you must go deep into HoME to find the answer. Beren is, in part, related to the riddle. Remember, it is "What am I?" not "Who am I?"

[Chrysophylax Dives]

‘But it is said in song that her tears falling from on high as she passed came like silver raindrops on the plain, and there a fountain sprang to life: the Fountain of Tinúviel, Eithel Nínui, most healing water until it withered in the flame.’ (Lost Road p. 322)

So are you the Fountain of Tinúviel?

[Drífa]

Well done, dragon! That is correct. Did you know right away when you came upon the text?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Well done, dragon! That is correct. Did you know right away when you came upon the text?

Not at all. I was only skim reading - those HoMe footnotes detailing minute changes can get a bit tedious but I have to go over everything because you never know where a valuable clue is going to turn up (I mean a clue to Tolkien's thinking). So when I read that passage something at the back of my mind twitched, but I did not know what. Then I made the connection with your riddle, but it was only vague. And actually, only after I had posted the answer did I see how the last bit of the riddle made sense.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

What have I got in my pocket?

[Drífa]

Fish pins?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Luckily, I'd just a moment before taken all the fish pins out of my pocket.