Riddles in the Dark

[Ercassie]

I was going to guess the dwarves who show up at Bilbo's door, with their hats (above) and belts (below).

For eg. I can work with that to make : Dwalin, Balin, Fili and Kili, with their green, scarlet and twin blue hats.

But the 'blue, white, yellow yellow' doesn't quite match up.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

I was going to guess the dwarves who show up at Bilbo's door, with their hats (above) and belts (below).

For eg. I can work with that to make : Dwalin, Balin, Fili and Kili, with their green, scarlet and twin blue hats.

But the 'blue, white, yellow yellow' doesn't quite match up.

Well, Ercassie, I reckon the Dwarf would hold out but I'm giving you this.

Below are not BELTS but BEARDS. (I am wondering if the colours change with the editions. I'm using a copy of the first edition, where Dwalin has a blue beard, Balin a white beard, and Fili and Kili both yellow.)

Wow! Your turn, now. I still remember coming into the riddle game in those covid years with an almost impossible riddle about a green stone.

[Drífa]

@Ercassie - nice.

[Ercassie]

My thanks indeed for such generous judgement . I do apologise for having rewarded you until now with a bit of a wait for a replacement. I do not presume my offering may cause you as much head scratching as the Elessar once did. But riddles are like that. Some guessed in an hour, others not for many weeks. Anyway, here you go:


Small am I and plain to see
Still great promise dwells within me.
From the mighty came mundane
and what was ruined never then the same.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Ah.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

OK. Here is a first guess, basically the image that arises as the lines of the riddle begin to sink in, so a first stab in the dark really.

Are you Frodo Baggins?

[Ercassie]

Sorry, no. I am not Frodo Baggins. Though he likely has seen me.

[Drífa]

Oh, I thought your first guess was 'Ah.', dragon? I was wondering who/what that was.

Are you the small box Galadriel gave Sam as a gift in memory of Lothlórien?

[Ercassie]

And of course you're absolutely correct @Drifa. Well done.

The box is described as small and plain.
Inside holds a seed for new life.
It was given by Galadriel, though it looked like a mere box of dirt.
Sam used the contents to restore the Shire after the Scouring. And in place of the ruined Party Tree grew from that seed .. a mallorn tree. The only one of its like in that land.

Back to you.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Sigh. I was just settling down to the long haul. However, I have learned better than to breathe any hint of a complaint as the natural order of the riddle thread reasserts itself.

It was a nice riddle, @Ercassie. Thank you. But as you said it might, it went fast.

Well done, @Drifa . Hit us with an Adamanta Chubb!

[Drífa]

Good riddle, Ercassie! Thank you! There is no time for unlockable locks and symbolic red spots. But do try this easy-peasy one!

Middle-earth related
No love have I for its sharpness
No love have I for its quickness
No love have I for their glory.
What they defend is what I uphold;
honour, antiquity, beauty, and wisdom.
Who am I, and of what do I speak?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Faramir, speaking of Gondor.

War must be, while we defend our lives against a destroyer who would devour all; but I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend: the city of the Men of Númenor; and I would have her loved for her memory, her ancientry, her beauty, and her present wisdom. Not feared, save as men may fear the dignity of a man, old and wise.

[Drífa]

That is correct, dragon. :) You are up!

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Two servants,
burned and buried,
nameless and named.
The named feared the dark;
marks on a stone recall that one.

[Ercassie]

My initial thought is taking me to Gandalf and the Balrog with their legendary duel in Moria. But it's Friday, and I'm tired, and it's likely wide of the mark.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Tis not a bad initial thought, and I think I see what prompted it. And I waited until Saturday morning, when hopefully you are less tired, to say: No.

PS. I recited this riddle to my family last night when we were eating, and for the benefit of my son's girlfriend they translated the lines into Hebrew. If anyone wishes I can type out the Hebrew version as a sort of totally unhelpful bonus clue.

[Drífa]

Is it regarding Pippin and Merry (orcs and fallen comrades burned and buried) and the brooch that Pippin lets fall and recalled by Aragorn when the brooch is found mentioning Pippin and not Merry and Pippin scratching marks on the brooch? : '.

Yes,' he said, 'they are quite plain: a hobbit's footprints. Pippin's, I think. He is smaller than the other... TTT, The Riders Of Rohan

Aragorn turned the brooch over. The underside of the leaf
was of silver. 'It is freshly marked,' he said. 'With some pin or
sharp point it has been scored.¹⁵ See! A hand has scratched on it
.' HoME vol.7, The Riders of Rohan

I am not sure about this line: The named feared the dark;

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Is it regarding Pippin and Merry (orcs and fallen comrades burned and buried) and the brooch that Pippin lets fall and recalled by Aragorn when the brooch is found mentioning Pippin and not Merry and Pippin scratching marks on the brooch?

No. The riddle refers to a stone, but the brooch would be a leaf (of Lorien). Well, it should be, and in any case this was not the answer I was looking for. (And o my, it has been a while since I said this:)

Try again!

[Ercassie]

What about Snowmane (the horse of Theoden) and the Witchking ?

The remains of them both are noted as marking forever the Pelennor fields, after the battle there which saw them each to their ends. One is a servant of good, and the other a servant of evil; and thus Snowmane was buried with honour under a mound where grasses later blossomed, and his name was marked upon a stone. Whereas the fall of the Witchking and his steed left only scorched earth where nothing grew thereafter. Snowmane could be said to be the servant who 'feared the dark', given that he had reared up in terror even as his master cried out to 'fear no darkness'.

[Drífa]

For some reason, I thought the brooch was of stone overlaid in silver. My bad.

I think I read something that may be more in tune with the riddle. I must go check it out. You may have given a hint (directly or indirectly) by stating that it is, indeed, a stone.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

What about Snowmane (the horse of Theoden) and the Witchking ?

The remains of them both are noted as marking forever the Pelennor fields, after the battle there which saw them each to their ends. One is a servant of good, and the other a servant of evil; and thus Snowmane was buried with honour under a mound where grasses later blossomed, and his name was marked upon a stone. Whereas the fall of the Witchking and his steed left only scorched earth where nothing grew thereafter. Snowmane could be said to be the servant who 'feared the dark', given that he had reared up in terror even as his master cried out to 'fear no darkness'.

O yes! And to think that I told my family that you would all still be guessing by autumn.

Technically, Snowmane and the fell beast that the Witchking rides (not the Witchking - tbh, until now I had always thought that Nazgul = the mount, but it turns out Nazgul = the Ringwraith, and the mount is nameless).

Faithful servant yet master’s bane,
Lightfoot’s foal, swift Snowmane.

[Ercassie]

You really never can tell how long a riddle may take to be untangled, it's true.

And technically I did mention the fellbeast in my answer too but yes, my guess was actually of the Witchking and Snowmane. So, I shall concede to the gods of fair play and open the floor to whoever can think up something to stump us with next.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Haha! Technically, you can do whatever you wish, Ercassie. By my lights you got that one. :) But that is the trouble with guessing a riddle. We shall wait and see who comes up with one - better to wait for one to organically arise than force one, I reckon.

[Drífa]

Good guess, Ercassie! I was off with Cirion, which was far from the correct answer. I may have a riddle later today.

[Drífa]

Okay, good luck with this one. I can not puzzle it out myself. Just kidding. I think it is pretty straightforward.

Middle-earth Related
Peril and contemplation lead to rote and rocks;
words and symbols require courage and determination;
moments of pause and partnerships necessitate space and caution;
strength and power summoned quickly.
Who will guide the way? And who will stay?

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Sounds to me a kind of wizard?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Amon Hen

[Drífa]

Nope, not a wizard and not Amon Hen.

[Saranna]

The Council of Elrond????

[Drífa]

@Saranna - Good guess, but this event took place way before the council of Elrond.
Try again! A hint will follow.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Breakfast, before the Council of Elrond begins?

From a Hobbit perspective, it was way before the Council.

Btw, Dwarf, you did say that a clue would follow another guess.

[Arnyn]

The flight of the noldor?

[Drífa]

No, not breakfast and not the flight of the Noldor.

There is a hint in one of my congratulatory posts on this page. Good luck!

[Chrysophylax Dives]

The Tomb of Elendil

[Arnyn]

Ohhh GOOD GUESS! (imo anyway - I was gonna go for the same!)

[Drífa]

No to tomb and nay to going the same. I thought this was obvious. Who will guide the way? And who will stay?

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Is this about 'Shadow of the Past'? With the Ring-verse read and Frodo not sure what to do?

[Drífa]

There is a hint in one of my congratulatory posts on this page. Good luck!

What post was that information in? No, the answer has nothing to do with hobbits.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Okay, good luck with this one. I can not puzzle it out myself. Just kidding. I think it is pretty straightforward.

Middle-earth Related
Peril and contemplation lead to rote and rocks;
words and symbols require courage and determination;
moments of pause and partnerships necessitate space and caution;
strength and power summoned quickly.
Who will guide the way? And who will stay?

@Turien Took, any chance you can do anything with this? (Nobody else can, so don't worry if the dark lines of the Dwarf leave you mystified too.)

[Turien Took]

I've racked my brains and have summoned allies in an attempt to decipher this riddle...is it possibly the reading of the moon-letters that Elrond deciphers on Thorin's map?

[Drífa]

There is a hint in one of my congratulatory posts on this page. Good luck!

The congratulatory post I speak of is a recent post. What I mean by that is it is not a year-old post but a few months ago. Good luck!

[Chrysophylax Dives]

@Turien Took, I'm sorry to say that Dwarves really do speak like this - at least on the riddle thread. If you are one of those people who like a challenge and you wish to enter a state of crazed obsession that leads to solution of this riddle, then we will all be very much obliged (and then send you to a second Dwarf riddle, in Fangorn). Basically, from experience, I'd suggest that the Dwarf's 'clues' are usually harder to make sense of than the original riddle.

That said, the astonished sense of pleasure, satisfaction, and general 'i am a genius' feeling that arises on the very rare occasion of guessing the right answer almost makes up for the months and months of pain and frustration.

[Drífa]

It is not Elrond deciphering Thorin's map. The riddle is set in a much earlier period. Please try again, @Turien Took.


@Chrysophylax Dives
HINT:
There_is_a_hint_on_this_page_(page_23_). The_post_that_the_hint_is_in_is_only_a_few_months_old. In_the_post_I_praise_someone_for_guessing_a_riddle_correctly. I_hope_that_this_slow_paced_hint_is_not_to_difficult_to_make_sense_of.

Good luck!

[Turien Took]

@Drifa would this be an Entmoot? You have given us all a fabulous brain twist- but it is great fun to keep guessing and conspiring! I agree with your sentiment @Chrysophylax Dives :)

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Good guess, Ercassie! I was off with Cirion, which was far from the correct answer. I may have a riddle later today.

So this is surely the hint. This sent me off to Unfinished Tales, where Cirion and Eorl climb up the stone steps to the tomb of Elendil to swear one mightly oath, which reshapes the Southern Kingdom. That was wonderful and generated this Lore post. But it got me nowhere on the riddle.

I skipped over the first bit up in the North. Possibly the answer is there?

[Drífa]

No, @Turien Took, it is not an Entmoot.

One must not skip; one must ride.

[Turien Took]

Is it the Oath of Eorl, @Drifa ?

[Drífa]

@Turien Took - now you are on fire. But alas, I am another event closely related to the same period.

[Turien Took]

Is that smoke I smell? Alas, another guess from this blazing brain to yours, @Drifa - is this the Battle of the Field of Celebrant?

[Ercassie]

Peril and contemplation lead to rote and rocks;

This first line makes me think of Borondir who was sent out with his fellow messengers, by Cirion to Eorl, each with a message learnt by heart, and a stone bearing the seal of the Steward. That was under the threat of the invasion by the Balchoth.

The remainder of the riddle loses me thenafter. Not sure thus, whether this line of contemplation is at all relevant ?