Riddles in the Dark

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Nice one! Look forward to a Hobbit riddle!

Aiks, what does this line mean?

Copied we have been countless times over

[Periantar]

Hear me:
I sound of sadness.
Touch me:
Feel my life-force beneath cold skin.
Behold me:
Living beauty, yet turning to gold.
Use me
And keep fresh your way.


What am I?

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Chrys: Read my answer in an earlier post. The copying is little else than elven women's work in weaving, sewing and creation of the cloaks from a template and adapted to each person and themselves as Galadhrim. So thus copied many times over.

Periantar: Sure it was fun! Beautiful riddle poem!

[Periantar]

Thank you. I'm not sure if it's exactly what I want it to be, but I suddenly needed something to post!

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Periantar: As nobody posted yet, and I waited for others a few days to take a guess, I'll do mine today.

Are you the phial of light Galadriel gives to Frodo?

[Periantar]

@Aikári Salmarinian Nope, Though I like your guess. Galadriel's Phial I am not...

Hear me:
I sound of sadness.
Touch me:
Feel my life-force beneath cold skin.
Behold me:
Living beauty, yet turning to gold.
Use me
And keep fresh your way.


What am I?

BTW the first clue in the riddle is not so literal as the others...

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Periantar: Aww had strong the idea it was. Is it Eowyn then? She is sad, cold, beauty, but young still?

[Periantar]

Nope, sorry, getting colder now. You were definitely closer with Galadriel's Phial.

You're absolutley right about describing Eowyn, but remember, the first line is not so literal as that.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Periantar: Not Eowyn? Is it a song from Lothlorien? Or something that Galadriel sings? I have no idea further than the phial really. It comes the closest to it, what fits the description.

[Periantar]

Ooh, no, not a song, though you're clearly getting closer to my meaning in the first section,
"Hear me:
I sound of sadness."

Definitely back in the right part of M.E though.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

That bowl with water that Galadriel shows to Frodo and Sam in Lothlorien? It is cold water presumably and shows lively images.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Wow. I was certain you had it with Eowyn, Aiks.

This is a very mysterious riddle. A breath of fresh air. But I have no clue.

[Periantar]

@Aikári Salmarinian I'm afraid this is not the Mirror of Galadriel, though your definition of it seems to work well for that line - all four sections will definitely need to be tied into this riddle.

We're in the right area! and if you were at G's Mirror, our answer would verily be almost everywhere!

[Aikári Salmarinian]

In the right area? Lothlorien. Hmm? Are you the waters of the river Nimrodel/Celebrant that runs though this elven realm?

[Periantar]

Noooooooope.
Focusing on the final line might help a little

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Hear me:
I sound of sadness.
Touch me:
Feel my life-force beneath cold skin.
Behold me:
Living beauty, yet turning to gold.
Use me
And keep fresh your way.

Mallorn tree?

The riddle seems to be drawn out of Frodo's tree-climbing on Cerin Amroth. So we begin with the sound of the wind in the branches (this is the line I am least sure about), then Frodo touches the 'skin' of the tree and feels its life-force. The mallorns are all turning golden because of the time of year. And their leaves are used to pack lembas.

[Periantar]

Aha! We have a winner!
My dear dragon, well done!
Nailed it on every line except the first, which as I'd said, was the least literal. My connection there was simply how similar Mallorn sounds to forlon.

The Floor is yours good Sir!

[Chrysophylax Dives]

I'm working on a riddle. But while I am, if anyone has one to drop on our plate please feel free.

Aiks, especially you. I only got this because you put me in Lorien.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

I noticed you won, Chrys. That is nice. I did not relate the last line to mallorn and still don't see it.

[Periantar]

Hey @Aikári Salmarinian
"Use me and keep fresh your way," refers to lembas, which also gets called elvish waybread.

Lembas from Lothlorien was traditionally wrapped in Mallorn leaves and was said to keep fresh for months when wrapped in this way. Less literally, it was the lembas bread which sustained Frodo and Sam on their journey, or kept them fresh on their way.

Hope that clarifies my thinking

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Periantar: Oh yes, it does. Thank you! It never came to me. Was een good riddle poem. *gives thumps up*

[Chrysophylax Dives]

Aiks, 'solve' would be my preferred term rather than 'won'. The Lembas line was how I knew for sure that the answer was Mallorn. Anyways, here is a new riddle (which @Ercassie with her palantir will no doubt guess as quick as sneezing).

I know how many leaves are in the tree,
And the number of stars in the sky.
I walk the road that is lost,
Once carved like flesh.
I don't need a weatherman
To know which way the wind blows.

[Periantar]

@Chrysophylax Dives
hmmm, knowledge, counting, leaves, trees, stars, weather and wind...

Brain hurting...

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Periantar: Same for me. There is not a picture popping up in my mind. I leave it others to guess this. Could be one of the Maiar at least. But that is likely not.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

OK folks, I guess Ercassie is on holiday, as is the Dwarf. Those two I reckon would have guessed this particular riddle as soon as you could say 'rocks and knocks'. I will add another line.

[Periantar]

Ooh, ooh, ooh, might we be talking about old Roäc who was the son of Carc, and as such "a descendant of those [ravens] that had remained on the hill even after Smaug had driven out their old allies, the Dwarves?

[Drífa]

Are you, Ghân-buri-Ghân?

"Wind is changing!" he cried, and with that, in a twinkling as it seemed, he and his fellows had vanished into the glooms, never to be seen by any Rider of Rohan again. TRoTK, The Ride of the Rohirrim

[Periantar]

@Drifa I like your connection there withthe quote!

@Chrysophylax Dives I'm still thinking Roac the Raven from the Hobbit.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

@Periantar, it is odd because I somehow know why you made that connection to Roac - though I cannot explain it.

But Aiks and Perianter, was I not right? @Drifa has the answer.

‘Wild Men are wild, free, but not children,’ he answered. ‘I am great headman, Ghan-buri-Ghan. I count many things: stars in sky, leaves on trees, men in the dark... Many paths were made when Stonehouse-folk were stronger. They carved hills as hunters carve beast-flesh. Wild Men think they ate stone for food. They went through Druadan to Rimmon with great wains. They go no longer. Road is forgotten, but not by Wild Men.'

Ghan-buri-Ghan squatted down and touched the earth with his horny brow in token of farewell. Then he got up as if to depart. But suddenly he stood looking up like some startled woodland animal snuffling a strange air. A light came in his eyes.
‘Wind is changing!’ he cried, and with that, in a twinkling as it seemed, he and his fellows had vanished into the glooms, never to be seen by any Rider of Rohan again.

Dwarf, you up!

[Periantar]

@Chrysophylax Dives My thinking, clumsy as it may have been, went something like this

He said rock and knock, that makes me think of the bird that was knocking its beak on the rock in the Hobbit. Ooh, maybe I can force the idea of a bird into this (rather nicely crafted) riddle of the esteemed dragon's - Birds sit in trees with leaves, often fly under the stars, and never listen to the weatherman because they have a fairly low tendency to watch T.V and Roac was hanging around the end of a long road for the travellers...

I do apologise that I ever did this despicable thing to your nice riddle good sir dragon, *bows as low Farmer Giles of Ham picking up a stray penny from the ground*.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

hahahaha
thank you for the explanation! tis what i really like about riddles - the way they stir strange deep memories of the stories.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Chrys: Just reading this. Riddles are good if they come in five to ten rounds guessing. I don't rhyme still that Ghan person to your little poem. I wouldn't even know if it was written and guessed in Dutch. Too difficult for me. Well congrats to Drifa. Good luck to her to make you happy.

[Drífa]

My first thought regarding the dragon's riddle was Tom. But then I remembered reading that Tom was no "weather-master". Then, my thoughts travelled to Fangorn. I remember Treebeard mentioning nuts and acorns, and I thought he might have mentioned leaves and stars. But that chapter led me to a dead end. The line, I walked the road that is lost, made me think about Aragorn and the chapter The Passing of The Grey Company, leading to further reading and the Púkel-men.

A good riddle, dragon!

I hope this one is not too perplexing.

~Middle-earth Related~
Most fell, but I stuck, resembling something that I am not.
Behind and beyond a wide brim, darkness surged in masses;
evil yielding shaft and blade, evil glare in ichor shades.
What did I now resemble?

[Periantar]

I don't quite get the "What did I now resemble?" line. I'm wondering if we are referring to something/one that can change appearance but for the most of history has been known by one appearance.

Most fell, reminds me both of fallen soldiers and of fallen angels, or perhaps of balrogs who were "fallen" maiar, and most of whom of course, fell in battle. the only one I know of who didnt fall long ago was Durin's bane. I know that as he moves on the fellowiship in the Mines of Moria, there were masses of orcs surging about before and behind him, and yet he is so terrible, that even the evil orcs yeield before him. Then there's the burning red, or ichor shades of his flame.
I think this may be a fallen maia that now resembles a balrog, else, Durin's bane himself.

[Drífa]

No, not Durin's bane himself, but a cookie for you for being in the right place.

I fear my riddling skills do little to tease the brain that tickles the imagination because they seem muddled. I have rearranged the lines of the riddle. Please do try again.

~Middle-earth Related~
Most fell, but I stuck, resembling something that I am not.
What do I now resemble?
Behind and beyond a wide brim, darkness surged in masses;
evil yielding shaft and blade, evil glare in ichor shades.

[Periantar]

Hmm, @Drifa racking brains for things in Moria since I'm in the right place.

I previously thought "ichor" referred to red (the colour of blood) but since discovered that it refers to the golden blood of the gods, so, hmmm - evil, gold, didn't fall, something that I am not

... hmmm

[Drífa]

@Periantar Yes, but riddles are tricksy, and one must not always take words too literally, in my opinion. Your previous thought was more accurate.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Could refer to a dragon(type), Periantar? Just helping out a bit.

[Drífa]

No, not a dragon (type).

[Aikári Salmarinian]

The evil wolves of the icy plains?

[Drífa]

Oh, no, not the evil wolves. If you read @Periantar guesses, you will see that you are far from the right place, Aiks.

Look carefully at line three of the riddle; there is a hint of where precisely I am.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Drifa, line three doesn't say much to me alas. But could you be one of the Istari? Saruman in particular? Just a wild guess.

I'll try to do my best, but I am bad at it.

[Drífa]

The best is all you can do, Aik.

No, not a person.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Are you a thing or a place?

[Drífa]

We are in the riddle thread, Aiks - not who, what or where.

Look carefully at line three of the riddle; there is a hint of where precisely I am in the middle of the sentence.

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Drifa: Riddles are really my enemy. I don't see the hint in line three, nor starts burning a light with me. I think Periantar is able to solve it. I know you are a real star in creation and solving riddles.

After some internal translations and description searching, and jumbling with the sentences to see more logic....

Behind and beyond a wide brim/gap, darkness surged in masses;
evil yielding shaft/arrow and blade/sword, evil glare in ichor/ethereal fluid shades.
Most fell (over the brim), but I stuck (held to it), resembling something that I am not.
What do I now resemble?

I have to think of Gandalf hanging from the rests of the small bridge, just before leaving Moria. Much what Periantar had already concluded in his post of 23-09-2024 on the Balrog.

That is how much I can analyse it.

Aiks

[Drífa]

Ah, you are thinking much closer now. Though, brim has other meanings, eh?

[Aikári Salmarinian]

Drifa: Brim means 'randje' in Dutch. It can be a brim of anything really, standing on the brim = staan op een randje. Sorry I don't know any other meanings to brim than what it is, not in English. I'll keep to Gandalf then, who could be the answer.

[Drífa]

Yes, keep to Gandalf.

[Chrysophylax Dives]

~Middle-earth Related~
Most fell, but I stuck, resembling something that I am not.
What do I now resemble?
Behind and beyond a wide brim, darkness surged in masses;
evil yielding shaft and blade, evil glare in ichor shades.

The question is 'What do i now resemble?'

My guess: Saruman.